VN Ren'Py Where It All Began [Ch. 3 Full] [Oceanlab]

[yossa999]

Could you recall a situation of conflict between the MC and someone else where Miru would take the MC's side? So far I see Miru taking the side of his opponent without even hearing the full stories of both sides (I'm talking about the situation with Katie for example).

In my opinion, most of the situations you are talking about is an ancient ritual where girls in a mixed group with one guy ganging up against him and start teasing him constantly. And his girlfriend has the main role in this show, when she loudly and theatrically complains to her friends about how bad he is, how little he cares about her, fucks her only three times a day and only tells her fifty times a week how much he loves her. If they didn’t tease him, it would mean only one thing, they are not interested in him at all, and if his girlfriend is among them, he seems to have problems in relationship.

In the meantime, Miru acts in the MC's best interests. She spies on his relatives and collects information for him. He has no idea how to behave with them now, after a long break. She helps him with that. And the situation with Helen is driving him crazy, he doesn’t understand what the hell is going on here.

In Katie's situation, I see Miru as a driving instructor who, perhaps somewhat rudely, points out the MC's mistakes in real time and demands that they be corrected. Wouldn't you agree that the ultimate goal of her actions is to help MC find common ground with the grown-up Katie and get rid of the old quarells?

In the scene with Gina, Miru gets angry at him when he greets Gina in a rude manner. It is clear that the MC and Gina have such a close relationship that a joke about her weight is not perceived by her as something offensive, but nevertheless, this is still asshole behavior on his part and Miru immediately lets the MC know about it.

Maybe the MC is getting a little bored of her. Can you imagine having sex with the same woman 3 times a day, 7 days a week for five years? Under those circumstances, I'm surprised he can even get it up for her. Miru says that sex with the MC is good but it doesn't happen as often as she would like, you can see this dialogue several times during the game.

Well he should work on his moves then and impress her.
Whether he is bored or not is up to you, the player, to decide.

Regarding her violent tendencies, do you think it's a kind of femdom game between them? That's a pretty interesting theory, even though I see the situation differently, but at least I understand how you see it.

Nah, I don’t see any bdsm-ish tendencies in her behavior, she doesn’t behave like a typical mistress in a leather outfit. I'd say she's very gentle and submissive with him (although she almost always initiates intercourse) and they've been pretty vanilla so far in private.

Regarding her fighting potential - you're wrong to think that she can't overpower an opponent who is much bigger than her. In Ocean's universe, knowledge of martial arts gives you super strength and speed and allows you to ignore such a minor factor as the difference in height and size (you can see it in the example of Ayua or Miru from the old version).

It's hard to argue with that. But you don't mean that Miru is keeping him around by brute force, right?

I'm interested in your last sentence. Do you think that the fact that he ran away from home is a manifestation of his strong will and determination? I thought he ran away from home because he was a coward and selfish. He decided to run away from the problem instead of facing it head on and ended up making more trouble for himself and his family.

But he can have cowardly (in the sense of fear of the consequences of his actions) and selfish motivation, but at the same time act with determination, showing a strong will in achieving his selfish goals. I don't see any real contradiction here.

I think the fact that he ran away from home instead of trying to resolve the conflict just shows that he was a typical teenager who had no life experience and acted impulsively without thinking.
If he had put his will and determination into finding a better solution, I'm sure he wouldn't have had to run away and we wouldn't have WiAB, because there would be nothing to tell about What the hell, half the plots of literature are based on stupid decisions and their consequences.

And at least I don't think he was acting selfishly. Stupid, yes, but he believed that he was protecting his loved ones and saving his family from breaking.

 

[yossa999]

For me, when WiaB ends, that's it. There is nothing else. Fuck SG.

What are you talking about, Steam dudes are spreading rumors about a third game he's about to launch

 

[Deleted member 6168082]

maybe we'll get more frequenct complaints about updates with more frequent updates?

Eh, don't get your hopes up. I feel like he'll end up giving up on both games, sooner or later. If he just chooses to focus on one game, maybe one of them will see the light of day and get the "completed" tag.

Also, Ocean can always just come on here to read comments and such, you just would never know. He doesn't need to have an account named "Ocean" to do that.

Let's see if I end up right or wrong, only time will tell.

I just find SG boring af.

I agree.

I just skipped the whole thing and closed the game. (that dnd shit was stupid and a waste of time)

I like the older version of the MC/game. He/it was darker. Now, he just feels like a bitch who gets pulled around by all these sluts, especially Nami/Bella

 

[BobTheDuck]

Eh, don't get your hopes up. I feel like he'll end up giving up on both games, sooner or later. If he just chooses to focus on one game, maybe one of them will see the light of day and get the "completed" tag.

Also, Ocean can always just come on here to read comments and such, you just would never know. He doesn't need to have an account named "Ocean" to do that.

Let's see if I end up right or wrong, only time will tell.



I agree.

I just skipped the whole thing and closed the game. (that dnd shit was stupid and a waste of time)

I like the older version of the MC/game. He/it was darker. Now, he just feels like a bitch who gets pulled around by all these sluts, especially Nami/Bella

As Ocean has just entered a lease for 10K worth of video cards, he's unlikely to give up soon. He's about to hit a major target with the steam release. I can't imagine what he'd use the video cards for other that his intended purpose. I'm not getting my hopes up, simply because greater capacity technically simply means more chances to be a perfectionist. I know that myself too well.

Ocean is more likely to avoid here because whatever you stare at exterts gravity on you. Sure he could, but why would he want to? I'm sure he got some patrons who keep their finger on the pulse instead.

In my opinion, most of the situations you are talking about is an ancient ritual where girls in a mixed group with one guy ganging up against him and start teasing him constantly. And his girlfriend has the main role in this show, when she loudly and theatrically complains to her friends about how bad he is, how little he cares about her, fucks her only three times a day and only tells her fifty times a week how much he loves her. If they didn’t tease him, it would mean only one thing, they are not interested in him at all, and if his girlfriend is among them, he seems to have problems in relationship.

In the meantime, Miru acts in the MC's best interests. She spies on his relatives and collects information for him. He has no idea how to behave with them now, after a long break. She helps him with that. And the situation with Helen is driving him crazy, he doesn’t understand what the hell is going on here.

In Katie's situation, I see Miru as a driving instructor who, perhaps somewhat rudely, points out the MC's mistakes in real time and demands that they be corrected. Wouldn't you agree that the ultimate goal of her actions is to help MC find common ground with the grown-up Katie and get rid of the old quarells?

In the scene with Gina, Miru gets angry at him when he greets Gina in a rude manner. It is clear that the MC and Gina have such a close relationship that a joke about her weight is not perceived by her as something offensive, but nevertheless, this is still asshole behavior on his part and Miru immediately lets the MC know about it.


Well he should work on his moves then and impress her.
Whether he is bored or not is up to you, the player, to decide.


Nah, I don’t see any bdsm-ish tendencies in her behavior, she doesn’t behave like a typical mistress in a leather outfit. I'd say she's very gentle and submissive with him (although she almost always initiates intercourse) and they've been pretty vanilla so far in private.


It's hard to argue with that. But you don't mean that Miru is keeping him around by brute force, right?


But he can have cowardly (in the sense of fear of the consequences of his actions) and selfish motivation, but at the same time act with determination, showing a strong will in achieving his selfish goals. I don't see any real contradiction here.

I think the fact that he ran away from home instead of trying to resolve the conflict just shows that he was a typical teenager who had no life experience and acted impulsively without thinking.
If he had put his will and determination into finding a better solution, I'm sure he wouldn't have had to run away and we wouldn't have WiAB, because there would be nothing to tell about What the hell, half the plots of literature are based on stupid decisions and their consequences.

And at least I don't think he was acting selfishly. Stupid, yes, but he believed that he was protecting his loved ones and saving his family from breaking.

I think this is the value of Ocean's world building - the characters aren't merely puppets for the MC, they actually have their own opinions. THey can also disagree without needing to make everything a serious problem, they can be childish and not 100% calculating. We see Willi knows how to game Katie, getting her to reveal info, using her resentment at him as a lever if need be. Although he's implusive and an asshole, he's also clever enough to let that be a mask. The way he dealt with Donna kinda shows to me he's not as superficial as he pretends to be.

I'd say some of his asshole attitude is a screen to deflect attention - giving people what they expect of him so he can observe what's going on between the lines.

And yep, people can be dynamic, charismatic and confident in one area of life and completely broken in another. That's just life, not a contradiction at all. Or we're just all contrary to ourselves, something like that.

 

[K5434]

Does the Ch3 Download include Chapter 1-2 or do i have to start with the old 0.6 Version of the game?

 

[Deleted member 6168082]

As Ocean has just entered a lease for 10K worth of video cards, he's unlikely to give up soon. He's about to hit a major target with the steam release. I can't imagine what he'd use the video cards for other that his intended purpose. I'm not getting my hopes up, simply because greater capacity technically simply means more chances to be a perfectionist. I know that myself too well.

Ocean is more likely to avoid here because whatever you stare at exterts gravity on you. Sure he could, but why would he want to? I'm sure he got some patrons who keep their finger on the pulse instead.

You never know. Things happen and stuff that are planned hardly ever go that way. With how much life issues/problems happen to these AVN Devs, I wouldn't be surprised if people got a life update like that in the future.

Speaking of, still no release date for that Steam release for Summer's Gone. Also, with that version being for "everyone" and scenes getting removed/edited/censored?/songs getting removed, I don't know if many people would like that.

To get a Season 1 of something to then not be able to get future Seasons because of the Mature rating those will get, idk how the reviews will be. A lot is riding on just words that are said by him. Let's just see what happens.


Idk, curiosity killed the cat? even if he knows there could be a million negative things being said about him/his games, he still might want to take a peek. Through the negativity, there could be points, ideas, and other things that might help him. You just have to have thick skin and dust shit off your shoulders.

 

[nobody0]

Idk, curiosity killed the cat? even if he knows there could be a million negative things being said about him/his games, he still might want to take a peek. Through the negativity, there could be points, ideas, and other things that might help him. You just have to have thick skin and dust shit off your shoulders.

He talked about this before he left. He thinks the signal to noise ratio of this site isn't worth it, and he prefers to get feedback elsewhere. Which is an increasingly common choice amongst devs.

 

[HentaiKami]

He talked about this before he left. He thinks the signal to noise ratio of this site isn't worth it, and he prefers to get feedback elsewhere. Which is an increasingly common choice amongst devs.

It's quite understandable from Ocean's and other devs' point of view to ignore this site for feedback. Most game threads i watch eventually devolve into pretty toxic places for devs. With constant demands for changes to suit just them and insults at devs choices, very few threads manage to keep it constructive and supportive towards the devs. Most, like you said, look other places to get that constructive criticism. Which is sad since some of the devs have pretty much lost their passion to game projects, that showed promise, because of that kind of behaviour.

If i ever got the idea of start making games, i would most likely avoid this place when looking constructive criticism. Since the entitled toxicity, that some here have, targeted at me the dev, would most likely kill any passion i had for the project, especially considering this is pirate site and many of the complainers have not paid for the game in any way.

 

[BobTheDuck]

Does the Ch3 Download include Chapter 1-2 or do i have to start with the old 0.6 Version of the game?

Just download Ch3, that's the full version for now. the old 0.6 was scrapped and reworked from scratch

 

[superblackbirdx]

Looking forward for ch 3 to hit Android.

 

[The Krogan Dude]

How exactly is a nymphomaniac with violent tendencies and constant threats against you could be the best material for a long term relationship?

The dude has a fucking snake as a pet, he likes to live dangerously

 

[Envy*]

The dude has a fucking snake as a pet, he likes to live dangerously

When you see family and friends at the same time....

Besides, strange that it is a snake her pet, strangely like the animal which represents her twin's jewelry

 

[The Krogan Dude]

When you see family and friends at the same time.... View attachment 3319858

Besides, strange that it is a snake her pet, strangely like the anime which represents her twin's jewelry

Ocean slytherin fan confirmed !

 

[hermit_tr]

Looking forward for ch 3 to hit Android.

"Ch 3 full" is out, but I forget where. The beta version can be obtained at Koga3.

You must be registered to see the links

There are only around 20 additional pages in the full version.

 

[Envy*]

Ocean slytherin fan confirmed !

EDIT.

By the way, I don't know if the question has already been asked, but I just noticed that in the gallery, the images of Dana are blocked, that's normal, especially since I chose the "Milf" route in the start of the game ?

 

[Zeniks1895]

I just passed that point in my playthrough (Katie, Miru & William on the sofa, not-watching the show)
It's clear to me that Miru is taking Katie's side to get close to her. She's mirroring Katie, which makes Katie subconsciously like her. Later, William asks Miru about her impression, and she says Katie will tell her (what Leia wants) when they get closer.
To me, this means Miru is entirely on-board with William.


This is up to the player, I think. Do you want an open relationship because your William is bored with Miru?
And yes, Miru's libido is much higher, and William's refraction period is longer. They've been together over 5 years now, and seem to make it work.


This I'm not clear on either. Early on, William made it seem that he escaped a toxic environment. Yet now, it seems he ran away because of something he did to Katie. To be honest, this style of storytelling frustrates me. Everybody knows what went on, except for the player.
Though, about facing it head-on... He was 16 when he ran away. How much power does a 16-year-old have?

In my opinion, most of the situations you are talking about is an ancient ritual where girls in a mixed group with one guy ganging up against him and start teasing him constantly. And his girlfriend has the main role in this show, when she loudly and theatrically complains to her friends about how bad he is, how little he cares about her, fucks her only three times a day and only tells her fifty times a week how much he loves her. If they didn’t tease him, it would mean only one thing, they are not interested in him at all, and if his girlfriend is among them, he seems to have problems in relationship.

In the meantime, Miru acts in the MC's best interests. She spies on his relatives and collects information for him. He has no idea how to behave with them now, after a long break. She helps him with that. And the situation with Helen is driving him crazy, he doesn’t understand what the hell is going on here.

In Katie's situation, I see Miru as a driving instructor who, perhaps somewhat rudely, points out the MC's mistakes in real time and demands that they be corrected. Wouldn't you agree that the ultimate goal of her actions is to help MC find common ground with the grown-up Katie and get rid of the old quarells?

In the scene with Gina, Miru gets angry at him when he greets Gina in a rude manner. It is clear that the MC and Gina have such a close relationship that a joke about her weight is not perceived by her as something offensive, but nevertheless, this is still asshole behavior on his part and Miru immediately lets the MC know about it.


Well he should work on his moves then and impress her.
Whether he is bored or not is up to you, the player, to decide.


Nah, I don’t see any bdsm-ish tendencies in her behavior, she doesn’t behave like a typical mistress in a leather outfit. I'd say she's very gentle and submissive with him (although she almost always initiates intercourse) and they've been pretty vanilla so far in private.


It's hard to argue with that. But you don't mean that Miru is keeping him around by brute force, right?


But he can have cowardly (in the sense of fear of the consequences of his actions) and selfish motivation, but at the same time act with determination, showing a strong will in achieving his selfish goals. I don't see any real contradiction here.

I think the fact that he ran away from home instead of trying to resolve the conflict just shows that he was a typical teenager who had no life experience and acted impulsively without thinking.
If he had put his will and determination into finding a better solution, I'm sure he wouldn't have had to run away and we wouldn't have WiAB, because there would be nothing to tell about What the hell, half the plots of literature are based on stupid decisions and their consequences.

And at least I don't think he was acting selfishly. Stupid, yes, but he believed that he was protecting his loved ones and saving his family from breaking.

You believe that Miru had only the best intentions in mind and wanted to help our MC establish good relationships with other people from his past. She uses various manipulations to gain their trust and extract information. That's a pretty good explanation. I thought she was just bored and likes to pry into other people's business (I know a few people like that irl).

Regarding her propensity for violence being justified by our MC's extremely wrong attitude towards other people - I find it quite humiliating. Our MC is not a little kid who needs his mammy to control his behaviour and smack him on the lips if he says the wrong thing, he is a grown man and needs to watch his own behaviour and take responsibility for his actions. And I'm not saying that he shouldn't behave like a jerk, I'm saying that it's the player who should decide, not Miru, how the protagonist will behave with appropriate consequences for his actions (to behave nicely with others and win their sympathy or to get into a confrontation and burn all bridges).

As for their sexual interactions, my opinion is based on Miru's complaints about the lack of sex (even if you chose all available interactions of this kind during your game session) and the rather sluggish interaction with her on the part of the protagonist, the instigator is almost always Miru while the protagonist only lazily agrees.

I don't quite see how him running away from home could help protect his family. Let's say he had sex with his twin sis, Katie caught them doing it and threatened to tell their parents. Then he runs away from home because he's afraid of the consequences and...? How does this help keep the family from falling apart? What stops Katie from telling after he runs away? No, no, no, the only thing he was protecting was his own ass. Katie was right about him (I mean, their dialogue one on one in the pool scene). At least that's my impression right now.

In any case I now have a much better understanding of your sympathy for the character Miru, even if I see it somewhat differently. Thank you for your time.

 

[Quetzzz]

I thought she was just bored and likes to pry into other people's business

This was my first impression as well, when Miru asks Gina about William's past. It's only later that things clicked for me, by something that Gina said: "the truth being in the middle". Everyone has their perspective, and knowing just William's isn't enough for Miru to help.

Our MC is not a little kid who needs his mammy to control his behaviour and smack him on the lips if he says the wrong thing, he is a grown man and needs to watch his own behaviour and take responsibility for his actions. And I'm not saying that he shouldn't behave like a jerk, I'm saying that it's the player who should decide, not Miru, how the protagonist will behave with appropriate consequences for his actions (to behave nicely with others and win their sympathy or to get into a confrontation and burn all bridges).

I haven't progressed very far beyond the 2nd breakfast (before they leave for the farm), but I haven't seen Miru being violent toward William. That said, I agree with what you say.
One of my frustrations with WiAB is that William knows about his past, but the player is kept in the dark. We see William flip-flop between being assertive and submissive, and I have no idea why. He ran away when he was 16, I don't think kids just run away if their home is a happy one. So even if he wants to make amends (for whatever he did wrong), the rest of his family (and certainly his parents) aren't innocent in all of this. A little more background about the characters and more meaningful choices would make this story immensely more enjoyable for me.

I don't quite see how him running away from home could help protect his family. Let's say he had sex with his twin sis, Katie caught them doing it and threatened to tell their parents. Then he runs away from home because he's afraid of the consequences and...? How does this help keep the family from falling apart? What stops Katie from telling after he runs away? No, no, no, the only thing he was protecting was his own ass. Katie was right about him (I mean, their dialogue one on one in the pool scene). At least that's my impression right now.

I'm not clear on this, though I'm starting to lean towards your opinion. Personally, I see Helen as a psychological/emotional abuser. William had/has to walk on eggshells to stay on her good side. And it has been said that Dylan wasn't a good father either. William learned how not to be jealous by Helen, which, I think, is a weird thing to teach a 16-year-old. Also, I get the impression that William is the Cinderella in this family.
Why he ran away... I'm not sure. It's safe to say that he was afraid of consequences, and when the topic of returning home comes up, he says he's still afraid to go back and face everyone. What he did to earn those consequences is anyone's guess. He could've cheated on Leia with Katie (Leia alludes to William sleeping around), or he could've gotten involved with one of the gangs. I'm not sure if I have the patience to find out because I hate it when the MC has secrets for the player.

 

[BobTheDuck]

You believe that Miru had only the best intentions in mind and wanted to help our MC establish good relationships with other people from his past. She uses various manipulations to gain their trust and extract information. That's a pretty good explanation. I thought she was just bored and likes to pry into other people's business (I know a few people like that irl).

Regarding her propensity for violence being justified by our MC's extremely wrong attitude towards other people - I find it quite humiliating. Our MC is not a little kid who needs his mammy to control his behaviour and smack him on the lips if he says the wrong thing, he is a grown man and needs to watch his own behaviour and take responsibility for his actions. And I'm not saying that he shouldn't behave like a jerk, I'm saying that it's the player who should decide, not Miru, how the protagonist will behave with appropriate consequences for his actions (to behave nicely with others and win their sympathy or to get into a confrontation and burn all bridges).

As for their sexual interactions, my opinion is based on Miru's complaints about the lack of sex (even if you chose all available interactions of this kind during your game session) and the rather sluggish interaction with her on the part of the protagonist, the instigator is almost always Miru while the protagonist only lazily agrees.

I don't quite see how him running away from home could help protect his family. Let's say he had sex with his twin sis, Katie caught them doing it and threatened to tell their parents. Then he runs away from home because he's afraid of the consequences and...? How does this help keep the family from falling apart? What stops Katie from telling after he runs away? No, no, no, the only thing he was protecting was his own ass. Katie was right about him (I mean, their dialogue one on one in the pool scene). At least that's my impression right now.

In any case I now have a much better understanding of your sympathy for the character Miru, even if I see it somewhat differently. Thank you for your time.

The thing I consider about Ocean's characters is that they make their own decisions and will interfere with the MC's choices based on their own personal world view. They won't let him be a jerk without pushback - William actually mentions somewhere that Miru is helping him become a better person ie. he knows he's impulsive and takes things too far, and she acts as a balance. Her way to care for him (giving him Daphne time after taking him out to give him a cheer up, even if he didn't want cheerup sex) is not simply to be a cushion, but to push him into better choices. Miru knows he needs Daphne (super curious as to Willi and Daphne's history) so even though she is jealous of Daphne, she gives him a moment hoping it'll settle his mind. She is manipulative, but does seem to wear her heart on her sleep, and I truly think she does love him.

I like the fact that she'll act as his conscience, it shows support for him in his desire to be a better person, and not be too proud, thinking he can make all the choices on his own. Willi's choices lead to avoidance (as we see with Monica and adandoning the rest of the Zanes).

I also think that a 16 year old who is impulsive enough to creampie his girlfriend and dump her on his aunt's kitchen table is both crazy and socially maladjusted enough to run away from shit he knows he can't fix with fists or words. He was deeply disconnected from his feelings as a child, even looks as emotionally invested as Hayden Christensen in the flashbacks. Miru is kinda helping him through that disconnect. I think of her as his personal therapist/coach.

Willi's also an asshole to her as he bribes her with sex and makes part of their relationship transactional. But I also believe Miru's baby talk stems from mirroring Willi's own baby talk and upping the ante, so maybe she's also mirrored his sexual transactional behaviour in the poundy coupons and rules.

As far as Willi running away, I don't think he thought it through. He acted on impulse, ended up in prison, and it became far more serious than just running away. Post prison he built a new life with Daphne and Miru, being too ashamed of everything, and not being able to explain to himself properly. I also wonder if writing a book was part of him rehabilitating after prison?

This was my first impression as well, when Miru asks Gina about William's past. It's only later that things clicked for me, by something that Gina said: "the truth being in the middle". Everyone has their perspective, and knowing just William's isn't enough for Miru to help.


I haven't progressed very far beyond the 2nd breakfast (before they leave for the farm), but I haven't seen Miru being violent toward William. That said, I agree with what you say.
One of my frustrations with WiAB is that William knows about his past, but the player is kept in the dark. We see William flip-flop between being assertive and submissive, and I have no idea why. He ran away when he was 16, I don't think kids just run away if their home is a happy one. So even if he wants to make amends (for whatever he did wrong), the rest of his family (and certainly his parents) aren't innocent in all of this. A little more background about the characters and more meaningful choices would make this story immensely more enjoyable for me.


I'm not clear on this, though I'm starting to lean towards your opinion. Personally, I see Helen as a psychological/emotional abuser. William had/has to walk on eggshells to stay on her good side. And it has been said that Dylan wasn't a good father either. William learned how not to be jealous by Helen, which, I think, is a weird thing to teach a 16-year-old. Also, I get the impression that William is the Cinderella in this family.
Why he ran away... I'm not sure. It's safe to say that he was afraid of consequences, and when the topic of returning home comes up, he says he's still afraid to go back and face everyone. What he did to earn those consequences is anyone's guess. He could've cheated on Leia with Katie (Leia alludes to William sleeping around), or he could've gotten involved with one of the gangs. I'm not sure if I have the patience to find out because I hate it when the MC has secrets for the player.

For Leia, William sleeping around could easily just be what he did with Monica is his aunt's kitchen. The flashback in Ch3 Full shows Leia put far more weight on their relationship than Willi did. Willi abandoning Monica because he realised it was a dead end with her becomes a foreshadowing of Willi abandoning Leia, because his 16 year old mind knows it's socially suicide to be with "his special friend".

I don't think he's done anything with Katie in the past - Katie's big resentment is that he abandoned her right from the start and she can't trust him. Their dynamic is the least complicated I think. Katie is jealous for Willi's attention, and it'll develop through the story if he choses to open up to her, defend her from Leia etc. Katie is probably with Zoey because she has a bad vibe for men as tormentors simply because of how Willi treated her as a bibi.

Helen and Dylan... well, if Helen taught lessons in avoiding jealousy, it's probably because Dylan was sleeping around, or because Helen was turning Dylan into a cuck the whole time. Leia learnt being manipulative somewhere. I also don't believe Helen or DYlan wouldn't know about Willi or Leia. In some ways Dylan has my sympathy, the hug after the lifting challenge shows how starved for wholesome male company he was. I'd say he's the definition of hen pecked.

 

[Zeniks1895]

Personally, I see Helen as a psychological/emotional abuser. William had/has to walk on eggshells to stay on her good side. And it has been said that Dylan wasn't a good father either. William learned how not to be jealous by Helen, which, I think, is a weird thing to teach a 16-year-old. Also, I get the impression that William is the Cinderella in this family.
Why he ran away... I'm not sure. It's safe to say that he was afraid of consequences, and when the topic of returning home comes up, he says he's still afraid to go back and face everyone. What he did to earn those consequences is anyone's guess. He could've cheated on Leia with Katie (Leia alludes to William sleeping around), or he could've gotten involved with one of the gangs. I'm not sure if I have the patience to find out because I hate it when the MC has secrets for the player.

I can't say anything about Helen except that for some reason she feels a strong lust for the MC and she's generally become softer in character, which is quite unusual. In the previous game it was known that she was very fond of MC, he was her favourite child and she blamed Katie for his disappearance. In the new version of the game, however, she has a pretty good relationship with Katie, which at first confused me, but on second thoughts I came to the conclusion that in the new version Katie did not tell her parents anything about MC and his relationship with her twin sister, so MC's sudden disappearance was not blamed on her.Unfortunately the game doesn't have too much information about her to have a discussion, hopefully we'll get more information in future chapters.

Dylan really wasn't a good father according to MС. I don't know what the reason is in the new version, but in the old version it was because MС and Leia often bullied Katie, Dylan seeing this tried to balance their relationship by taking Katie's side and causing trouble for MС and Leia. Again in this game things got a lot more.... I don't know, soft? So it's hard to say if MС's reason for calling Dylan a bad father has changed.

If the reason MC ran away from home was because he cheated on Leia with Katie it would be pretty hilarious, but unfortunately that's not possible. You haven't made it to chapter three yet, so here's a mini spoiler - Katie is a virgin. It's possible he slept with his cousin Katarina and Katie threatened to tell Leia and their parents, but so far it's all idle speculation, not worth wasting time on.

 

[Quetzzz]

I also feel like a 16 year old who is impulsive enough to creampie his girlfriend and dum her on his aunt's kitchen table is both crazy and socially maladjusted enough to run away from shit he knows he can fix with fists or words. He was deeply disconnected from his feelings as a child, even looks as emotionally invested as Hayden Christensen in the flashbacks. Miru has kinda helping him through that disconnect. I think of her as his personal therapist/coach.

A note I made about Monica, is that she's partly to blame as well. She let William take her virginity on the kitchen table at Katarina's birthday party (and I suspect Katarina is a few years younger than William too). Anyone could've walked in, so she wasn't thinking clearly either. So it's a bit weird how she put so much importance on her virginity. It would've been a quick fuck, due to the circumstances.

Willi's also an asshole to her as he bribes her with sex and makes part of their relationship transactional. But I also believe Miru's baby talk stems from mirroring Willi's own baby talk and upping the ante, so maybe she's also mirrored his sexual transactional behaviour in the poundy coupons and rules.

Miru mirrors a lot more than that. For instance, the story she makes up about William having trained the spider is very reminiscent of how Will & Katie create a plan to battle the spiders. For me, this is borderline creepy, more so if she does it consciously.

Post prison he built a new life with Daphne and Miru

Don't forget about Renold. At least from context, it seems Renold had to know William (and Daphne?) well enough to know that the best shot at making Miru jealous was faking texts between Will & Daphne.
You mentioning Will having been in prison makes me want to continue playing, because of there finally being some background information in the future.

For Leia, William sleeping around could easily just be what he did with Monica is his aunt's kitchen. The flashback in Ch3 Full shows Leia put far more weight on their relationship than Willi did. Willi abandoning Monica because he realised it was a dead end with her becomes a foreshadowing of Willi abandoning Leia, because his 16 year old mind knows it's socially suicide to be with "his special friend".

I did consider that Leia's remark was about Monica, and maybe others. William learned from a young age that sex and love are separate, and that jealousy is a waste of time and emotions... Why wouldn't he fuck around as a horny teenager?
Thank you for mentioning the Chapter 3 flashback. Like I said above, I want more details, and the frustration of being blind compared to William isn't making for a fun experience.

Just an example of what I mean:
Burger joint:
Which sauce… Yet another time where the player is disadvantaged. For all we know, Katie loves spicy sauce. I want to take Miru's advice and be the better person, and William would know his sister's tastes. The player doesn't.
I make a save just in case, and pick the sweet sauce.

Katie is jealous for Willi's attention, and it'll develop through the story if he choses to open up to her, defend her from Leia etc. Katie is probably with Zoey because she has a bad vibe for men as tormentors simply because of how Willi treated her as a bibi.

This makes sense. I wondered where the constant push & pull between Will & Katie came from. We learned about what Will did through Gina, and it was clear Katie acts like she hates Will. Yet, when given the opportunity, she'll interact or even play with him.

Helen and Dylan... well, if Helen taught lessons in avoiding jealousy, it's probably because Dylan was sleeping around, or because Helen was turning Dylan into a cuck the whole time. Leia learnt being manipulative somewhere. I also don't believe Helen or DYlan wouldn't know about Willi or Leia. In some ways Dylan has my sympathy, the hug after the lifting challenge shows how starved for wholesome male company he was. I'd say he's the definition of hen pecked.

Yeah. This whole "Dylan was a bad father"-thing was swept under the rug very quickly. Dylan apologized, and Will immediately accepted. So I don't think Dylan was actually abusive toward him. I mean, if you gave your son a black eye for sneezing too loudly, then a simple apology wouldn't do.
About Helen's teaching's I wrote:
This talk does make clear that, above all, William yearns for his mother's approval. Did he learn not to be jealous because this is what she wanted? Was it conscious teaching on her part, or a lesson he had to learn due to her behavior?

I can't say anything about Helen except that for some reason she feels a strong lust for the MC and she's generally become softer in character, which is quite unusual. In the previous game it was known that she was very fond of MC, he was her favourite child and she blamed Katie for his disappearance. In the new version of the game, however, she has a pretty good relationship with Katie, which at first confused me, but on second thoughts I came to the conclusion that in the new version Katie did not tell her parents anything about MC and his relationship with her twin sister, so MC's sudden disappearance was not blamed on her.Unfortunately the game doesn't have too much information about her to have a discussion, hopefully we'll get more information in future chapters.

I had the impression that in the current version, it's Leia who blames William for everything. Though I can't really get a handle on Helen yet. Though, if she still lusts after William, then it would make sense to teach him not to be jealous. He'd have to share her, after all.
Maybe I should just wait a few years before playing again. Then I can just push through the early chapters to finally get some answers and context.

Dylan really wasn't a good father according to MС. I don't know what the reason is in the new version, but in the old version it was because MС and Leia often bullied Katie, Dylan seeing this tried to balance their relationship by taking Katie's side and causing trouble for MС and Leia. Again in this game things got a lot more.... I don't know, soft? So it's hard to say if MС's reason for calling Dylan a bad father has changed.

I would love it if it's still the same reasoning/explanation in the current version. It's great when characters have motivations for doing things, and overcompensating towards Katie for how Will & Leia mistreat her would be great. I'll need to pay more attention how Katie and Dylan get along.

If the reason MC ran away from home was because he cheated on Leia with Katie it would be pretty hilarious, but unfortunately that's not possible. You haven't made it to chapter three yet, so here's a mini spoiler - Katie is a virgin. It's possible he slept with his cousin Katarina and Katie threatened to tell Leia and their parents, but so far it's all idle speculation, not worth wasting time on.

Okay, that is funny! Thank you for that minor spoiler. I tend to overthink these things (though this was put in my brain by Katie not being bothered being in her underwear around Will), and this made me laugh at myself.